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Re: Trump: You have to 'take out' terrorists' families

By: DigSpace in ALEA | Recommend this post (0)
Fri, 04 Dec 15 10:57 AM | 98 view(s)
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Msg. 17727 of 54959
(This msg. is a reply to 17726 by Cactus Flower)

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Yes, when the religions of Abraham manage to forumlate a dogma largely consistent with the Enlightenment and the follow-on to that (race and gender liberties) then they are broadly tolerable. 'Western' Muslims self-identify this way, and in places like Iraq and Iran and Egypt they are likely the majority.

That powerful/rich states of geopolitical importance codify in law and practice a complete rejection of anything and everthing that came out of, broadly speaking, the Enlightenment (and the English pre-quel if one is splitting hairs) places them squarly at odds with acceptability.

I do not doubt that western leaders have long struggled with what they are faced with once they enter 1600 Penn and 10 Downing and similar such Abodes.

Smack dab in the middle of the "oh crap what do I do" moment that likely occurs soon after winning office is one thing : Saudi Arabia. It is much of what is bad about Islam, when it wanders from that it suffers internal rebellion (the raidicla takeovers in 1980 e.g.) and indeed spawns the likes of bin Laden frustrated over its excessive liberalism and partnership with the west.

So, what is a Bush or Clinton or Obama or Brown or Blair, or Major, Thatcher, Reagan, Carter to do?

I'm a disengage and contain guy.


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The above is a reply to the following message:
Re: Trump: You have to 'take out' terrorists' families
By: Cactus Flower
in ALEA
Fri, 04 Dec 15 10:19 AM
Msg. 17726 of 54959

needless to say, trump's ideas won't work.

the only solution i can see is a reformed version of islam for western consumption.

there just cannot be continuity between western ideas of islam and the ones practiced in, for instance, saudi arabia.

forget isis. saudi sharia isn't acceptable. killing people for apostacy is repellant and it is illegal in western societies. honour killing is cowardly and disgusting and it is illegal in western societies. beheading people for their sexuality is an abomination and is illegal in western societies. let women be free and equal because that is what the law says in western societies. etc.

the inability to understand that the problem is internal to islam is where the issue is. quit telling people they are islamophobic when they are liberal believers in a secular society and basic human rights. why should someone not reject dogmas that seek something different, regardless of whether they come cloaked in religious verse or a hijab? if you are arguing for the superiority of "god-made" rather than man-made law, then that is politics not religion and the argument is fair game.


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