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Re: Inside the surreal world of the Islamic State s propaganda machine 

By: Cactus Flower in ALEA | Recommend this post (1)
Sat, 21 Nov 15 10:27 PM | 129 view(s)
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Msg. 17659 of 54959
(This msg. is a reply to 17658 by Cactus Flower)

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Also, we need to educate ourselves in what Islam actually is. It isn't just a similar package to Christianity, but with a God called Allah who can exist alongside a secular state, just like Yhwh/Jesus/Ghost. It wants different things.

We can't assume being nice and showing solidarity and being multicultural and seeking to contain ISIS is enough. One keeps hearing that we should not do the things ISIS wants us to. I think we need to think of the things we need to do, and do them regardless of what ISIS wants. Just because ISIS wants a battle in Dabiq doesn't mean we should not give them one. Just because ISIS wants us to assert the secular values upon which Western society is based doesn't mean we shouldn't. We must because not doing so creates a sense of weakness. It empowers those who take advantage of the emptiness to promote a strict Islamic theocratic model, which they do relentlessly.

Do people even know what the foundations of Western society consist of? Why are politicians so pathetically unable to deliver the message? It's so goddam frustrating. Here's what we are about ... These are the intrinsic beliefs to which everyone must adhere if we are to live together (not arguments about socialism vs capitalism but things like individual liberty under the rule of SECULAR law) ... Here's what good things happen when we do so ... What's so hard about this.

Sometimes you even have to be hard-hearted if being kind will also do damage. We can't always be nice if someone takes advantage of it. This applies to refugees, amongst whom ISIS fighters move. The obligation to one's citizens holds a higher place than the obligation to save foreigners. Until you can separate the good people from the bad ones, you can't open the doors to everyone, but maybe you can let some folks in. Like Jews escaping Germany or Yazidis escaping ISIS or orphans who can be adopted or families with small children. But young, adult, male, unattached Moslems, maybe we cannot take the risk. Maybe those folks should head for Indonesia or Saudi Arabia or Kazakhstan or Turkey or Malaysia or Bangladesh or Pakistan or Algeria or Libya or Morocco or Egypt or the UAE or ....

Why do they head towards the West if their aim is only to escape ISIS? Surely the Umma will embrace them, as brotherly communities proclaim they ought to.

For us, immigration on this scale with such toxic people secreted amongst them is a murderous rampage or two, or ten, waiting to happen. What's the point of history if no one tries to understand its lessons?

Sometimes you have to fight for your beliefs. Not pretend it will all be okay if we are patient and tolerant of any competing idea, including violent ones. We can nice our way to extinction.




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The above is a reply to the following message:
Re: Inside the surreal world of the Islamic State s propaganda machine
By: Cactus Flower
in ALEA
Sat, 21 Nov 15 8:39 PM
Msg. 17658 of 54959

Hi clo,

They are keen on and evidently expert at marketing.

But I wouldn't necessarily call it propaganda. They are selling a sort of brutal reality that resonates with young Moslems.

The message is this: we are creating an Islamic caliphate that takes seriously the text of the Koran in the context of the prophet's sojourn in Medina. Medina was his period of resistance and warfare.

The message sells.

I worry that we are determined to avoid looking the reality in the face and so we respond as if this will all just blow away once people see the truth. This really is a form of spectrum Islam that is appealing to young warriors that are easily led to outrage and a sense of pious duty. Sometimes also it is a response to alienation for young Moslems in their homeland.

We have to persuade them to reinterpret what they are seeing and to whom they owe their loyalty. And to retake control of the communication medium.


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