Forum Home | Log in | Signup | My Page | Rules | FAQ | Boards | Members | Search
« ALEA Home | Email msg. | Reply to msg. | Post new | Board info. Previous | Home | Next

Re: Edward Snowden, the insufferable whistleblower

By: Cactus Flower in ALEA | Recommend this post (0)
Fri, 03 Jan 14 8:44 PM | 28 view(s)
Boardmark this board | The Trust Matrix 		Msg. 15084 of 54959
(This msg. is a reply to 15083 by Cactus Flower)
Jump:
Jump to board:
Jump to msg. #

Words of a great philosopher.

"Then again, from below, in the great heavy stack,
Came a groan from that plain little turtle named Mack.
"Your Majesty, please... I don't like to complain,
But down here below, we are feeling great pain.
I know, up on top you are seeing great sights,
But down here at the bottom we, too, should have rights.
We turtles can't stand it. Our shells will all crack!
Besides, we need food. We are starving!" groaned Mack.

"You hush up your mouth!" howled the mighty King Yertle.
"You've no right to talk to the world's highest turtle.
I rule from the clouds! Over land! Over sea!
There's nothing, no, NOTHING, that's higher than me!"

But, while he was shouting, he saw with suprise
That the moon of the evening was starting to rise
Up over his head in the darkening skies.
"What's THAT?" snorted Yertle. "Say, what IS that thing
That dares to be higher than Yertle the King?
I shall not allow it! I'll go higher still!
I'll build my throne higher! I can and I will!
I'll call some more turtles. I'll stack 'em to heaven!
I need 'bout five thousand, six hundred and seven!"

But, as Yertle, the Turtle King, lifted his hand
And started to order and give the command,
That plain little turtle below in the stack,
That plain little turtle whose name was just Mack,
Decided he'd taken enough. And he had.
And that plain little lad got a bit mad.
And that plain little Mack did a plain little thing.
He burped!
And his burp shook the throne of the king!

And Yertle the Turtle, the king of the trees,
The king of the air and the birds and the bees,
The king of a house and a cow and a mule...
Well, that was the end of the Turtle King's rule!
For Yertle, the King of all Sala-ma-Sond,
Fell off his high throne and fell Plunk! in the pond!"

http://www.spunk.org/library/prose/sp000212.txt

» You can also:
- - - - -
The above is a reply to the following message:
Re: Edward Snowden, the insufferable whistleblower
By: Cactus Flower in ALEA
Fri, 03 Jan 14 6:33 PM 		Msg. 15083 of 54959

I always assume the argument is weak when it depends upon a personal insult. If one says Snowden is insufferable, then the personality of the journalist is also in play. Is Ruth an insufferable suck-up to authority? It kinda seems so.

For myself, I believe in the values of freedom and I am comfortable defending them.

It isn't that freedom is a pure thing. It doesn't mean the absence of restrictions. It includes the need for safety just as it requires privacy. The balance between government and the governed has always been struck around the notion of probable cause/ reasonable suspicion. Mass surveillance was always ruled beyond the pale. But freedom will tolerate targetting of suspicious actors.

Although it is arguable, I admit the possibility that the price of freedom may be a higher immediate cost in terrorism. Isolated, smaller-scale terrorists may not get picked up by targeted surveillance operatives. But in the long run, I believe the condition of a free country is more robust than that of a surveillance state.

When the issue was Republican torture, I was against it. When the issue is broad surveillance run by a Democratic president, I am against it. These things do damage to the USA.

It isn't about Snowden. It's about the violations of liberty and privacy carried out by the US over a dozen years. This has to stop.

I think what people find insufferable about Snowden is that they have no answer to the fact that his loyalty is to the constitution and he slings its values, like little pebbles, right at them. Hard to argue with someone who says his loyalty is to the people. And who has demonstrated it at great personal cost.

In this story, who is the patriot? Is it the person who values his oath to the constitution? Or the clique that introduced torture, mass surveillance, drone assassination and secret rendition to the world and tried to keep them all secret from the population they are meant to represent?

« ALEA Home | Email msg. | Reply to msg. | Post new | Board info. Previous | Home | Next