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Re: most remarkable post-election revelation

By: Cactus Flower in ALEA | Recommend this post (0)
Fri, 09 Nov 12 7:57 PM | 87 view(s)
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Msg. 11592 of 54959
(This msg. is a reply to 11590 by DigSpace)

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absolutely spot on.

i'll tell you something else. i think that they were right that there was enthusiasm amongst republicans for replacing obama. this enthusiasm was real. but the price of enthusiasm from the right was loss of appeal to the middle. and so romney got fewer total votes than mccain.

instead of enthusiasm implying high population, the enthusiasm was coming from a smaller population of highly motivated people. it meant the folks voting for romney were especially enthusiastic. they turned up to events. but an enthusiastic voter still only has a single vote.

electoral support is bimodal by nature. but obama's support sat closer to the middle spot where the population bell curve is at its greatest.

it appears that white men are much more likely to be far right. they are enthusiastic about far right ideas. but there just aren't enough of them to win an election.

that's the way i interpret things, anyway.


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The above is a reply to the following message:
Re: most remarkable post-election revelation
By: DigSpace
in ALEA
Fri, 09 Nov 12 7:35 PM
Msg. 11590 of 54959

Fundamental to this error is a clear misinterpretation of what polling firms are doing.

A few polling firms normalize for affiliation. The good ones do not. Affiliation is an attitude that can change even over the course of a single interview. The right seems to think affiliation is like gender, race, and so on ... something one normalizes to. It is not.

from the CBS article:

"The state polls weren't oversampling Democrats and undersampling Republicans - there just weren't as many Republicans this time because they were calling themselves independents."

And this is what competent pollsters said from the beginning. They were not going out and selecting a set with 7% Dem "oversampling". They sampled a set based on age, race, gender and so on ... and of those people 7% more at that moment said "Democrat". So the right would change their data to for their projections of what "turnout" would be (that is what peoples attitude would be on exit polling as again, affiliation is an attitude).

He/she who normilizes to affiliation may as well normalize the vote. "We think Romney is going to get 53%, so we will normalize to that".

It is a fundamentally broken premise. Again "The state polls weren't oversampling Democrats and undersampling Republicans - there just weren't as many Republicans this time because they were calling themselves independents." One cannot normalize to what a respondent says as a function of current mood ... that is what you are seeking to determine, current mood, to normalize against that is simply to assert without evidence that their mood will change.

I brought this up a couple months ago and researched it. The right kept saying the polls were somehow deliberately calibrating to a 2008 Dem %. They were not. They said they were not. They were simply reporting what the respondents said on that matter. They calibrated to race, gender, age, LV and so on ... not attitude.


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