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Re: Presidents list

By: DigSpace in ALEA | Recommend this post (0)
Thu, 11 Oct 12 9:13 PM | 105 view(s)
Boardmark this board | The Trust Matrix 		Msg. 10770 of 54959
(This msg. is a reply to 10767 by xcslewis)
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On presidential rankings and Lincoln, i am currently confused over whether your opinion of Lincoln the President is determined by (e.g.) whether he was racist?

You state that he trampled a truth that states could withdraw as easily as they had joined. It would seem, an understanding that the union could take on debts at some level, and the understanding that Jefferson e.g. was no slouch with a pen, that it would have only taken him 30 or 40 words to describe clearly the exact methods by which one withdraws peacefully from the union.

I may be in error, but I am not aware of language defining the means by which a state may leave the union.

Again, and I am rather serious, if such a notion was so generally held and observed, why are the two or three sentences to describe that process absent? Certainly one simply adds an article saying, if at any time a state wants to cut and run they can do so by a simply majority, or a 2/3rds majority or whatever. Again, I am not aware of such language.

I think your "long held understanding" notion is presented as a de facto statement of fact and proof unto itself, but are there any links or texts or writing or recordings to suggest that union membership was revocable and invocable based on how one felt that morning?

It would seem your notion would require significant rewording of Article IV ... that essentially after each section the words "unless a state changes its mind" would have to be added.

Your notion requires a notion of severability I have never seen applied to any national charter.

So

Full Faith and Credit .. unless they change their mind,

Privileges and Immunities ... unless they change their mind

Fugitive and extradition ... unless they change their mind

Mutual protection ... unless they change their mind, or presumably that any collection of states chooses to mutually protect, or not ...

I just cannot see how what you state de facto as "the long held understanding" can ever or has ever resulted in anything resembling the creation or a nation state, or even a half baked feudal state for that matter.

So back to the first point,

does so much of this hinge on whether e.g. Lincoln was a racist ... as opposed to the top ranked presidents Washington or Jefferson?

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The above is a reply to the following message:
Re: Presidents list
By: xcslewis in ALEA
Thu, 11 Oct 12 8:42 PM 		Msg. 10767 of 54959

I hardly would have been easy-going about slavery. I am certain had I been alive in the 1850's I would have been an abolisionist.

The war resulted in the deaths of 620,000 Americans, the maiming of many thousands more, sorrow, despair, resentment and at a great economic cost.

Yes, slavery would have lasted longer and that was an injustice.

History is written by the victors. I make an honest effort to find the truth and often it seems things may not be as we beleive them to be. Others may choose to do so or not.

My opinion of Lincoln was entirely different a few short years ago.

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