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Re: Are Trumps lawyers selling him a bill of goods, or is he not listening?

By: Cactus Flower in ALEA | Recommend this post (0)
Mon, 23 Apr 18 6:15 AM | 66 view(s)
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Msg. 24735 of 52691
(This msg. is a reply to 24732 by clo)

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I don't think he listens. I think he believes he can shark the entire legal system from his position as president. This is why we are ending up with serious rule of law questions (unlike any recent president).

Yes, yes, I know, Obama! That's why I wrote "serious". Ridiculous, we had.

The rule of law is far older than America. It is America's good fortune to have it built into its foundations. Folks like Langton, Bracton, Coke, Rutherford, Harrington and Locke are the keystone of liberty.

"Since, moreover, for God and the betterment of our kingdom and for the better allaying of the discord that has arisen between us and our barons we have granted all these things aforesaid, wishing them to enjoy the use of them unimpaired and unshaken for ever, we give and grant them the under-written security, namely, that the barons shall choose any twenty-five barons of the kingdom they wish, who must with all their might observe, hold and cause to be observed, the peace and liberties which we have granted and confirmed to them by this present charter of ours, so that if we, or our justiciar, or our bailiffs or any one of our servants offend in any way against anyone or transgress any of the articles of the peace or the security and the offence be notified to four of the aforesaid twenty-five barons, those four barons shall come to us, or to our justiciar if we are out of the kingdom, and, laying the transgression before us, shall petition us to have that transgression corrected without delay." - Magna Carta

"The King ought not to be under any man but under God and the law." - Bracton

"The common law will controul Acts of Parliament, and sometimes adjudge them to be utterly void: for when an Act of Parliament is against common right and reason, or repugnant, or impossible to be performed, the common law will controul it, and adjudge such Act to be void." - Coke

"An empire of laws and not of men." - Harrington

"Freedom then is not what Sir Robert Filmer tells us, ... a liberty for every one to do what he lists, to live as he pleases, and not to be tied by any laws: but freedom of men under government is, to have a standing rule to live by, common to every one of that society, and made by the legislative power erected in it; a liberty to follow my own will in all things, where the rule prescribes not; and not to be subject to the inconstant, uncertain, unknown, arbitrary will of another man." - Locke

The wisdom of the founders of the United States was to channel these ideas into the American constitution, not to form them out of nothing themselves.




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The above is a reply to the following message:
Are Trump’s lawyers selling him a bill of goods, or is he not listening?
By: clo
in ALEA
Mon, 23 Apr 18 1:55 AM
Msg. 24732 of 52691

Are Trump’s lawyers selling him a bill of goods, or is he not listening?
By Jennifer Rubin April 22 at 12:00 PM

President Trump is so unwilling to accept reality, and his advisers, even his lawyers, may be afraid of telling him the truth. Either Trump misunderstood what they’ve told him or his lawyers are making stuff up to pacify him:

. Ty Cobb said the special counsel investigation would be over last Thanksgiving. Then by the end of the year.

. Rudolph W. Giuliani tells him he’s going to get the Russia investigation to wrap up in the next week or so.

. One of his lawyers seems to have told Trump he’s in no danger if he is not a “target” of the investigation.

. Trump seems to think everything in Michael Cohen’s office and whatever they talked about fall into the category of attorney-client privilege.

Trump’s lawyers act like it is their decision whether Trump will have to give testimony to special counsel Robert S. Mueller III.

These are false, in fact so preposterous that non-lawyers can tell they are nonsense. You don’t need to have gone to law school to know:

. No one has any idea when the Russia probe will end.

. Trump could fire Mueller, Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein and Attorney General Jeff Sessions, and the investigation would go on.

. Giuliani hasn’t practiced law in decades, has no ability to influence Mueller and isn’t all that helpful with respect to the Southern District of New York, where he ended his stint as U.S. attorney in January 1989.

. Trump might be a subject of the Russia investigation now, but Mueller can decide he is a target at any time really.

. “Fixing” isn’t covered by the attorney-client privilege, and plotting crimes with your attorney isn’t covered either. Most of what Cohen did does not seem to be legal work.

. Trump can be subpoenaed by the grand jury if he refuses to make himself available for an interview. A court would almost certainly enforce it.

If Trump is buying the hooey he’s being fed, he’s really much dimmer than his supporters thought. And here’s some more bad news his lawyers might not have told him (or if they did, he chooses to forget):

. James B. Comey’s memos don’t exonerate Trump. They provide contemporaneous, highly detailed confirmation of his efforts to obstruct the investigation. Oh, and plotting to fire Mueller and then Rosenstein to get rid of the investigation evidences a corrupt intent. Based on information that is already publicly known, there are likely sufficient facts to make a case for obstruction.

. We already know about collusion — the June 9 meeting at Trump Tower with Russian associates. Moreover, Paul Manafort may, according to prosecutors, have been the vital link between the campaign and Kremlin. No one and no document has exonerated Trump of collusion.

. The dossier has not been discredited. Some portion of it, according to Comey and others, was corroborated.

. If Trump fires Mueller and/or Rosenstein, there very likely will be mass protests, extreme pressure on the House to impeach and a batch of resignations at the Justice Department. Trump’s presidency would effectively be over. (By the way, because Sessions was so worried about Trump firing Rosenstein that he had to suggest he’d quit in protest, Republican lawmakers are flat wrong when they say there’s no chance Trump will fire Mueller or Rosenstein.)

. Trump may get subpoenaed in any number of civil cases (e.g., Summer Zervos’s defamation case, Stormy Daniels’s defamation case).

more:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2018/04/22/are-trumps-lawyers-selling-him-a-bill-of-goods-or-is-he-not-listening/?utm_term=.19f9b84b8568


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